Humble THQ bundle

Anything else
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tkmorris
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by tkmorris » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:46 am

I this case I can see that making money for charity is all that matters to them (HIB). A good thing there is competition in this market too, I already got some from Indie Gala's with Linux support and DRM free. Also soundtracks from Game Music Bundle too, just a matter of time until big companies start doing something alike. HIB will have to work harder to be able to actually stay different, they've got the leverage but we can see the path they've chosen from this bundle onward. Instead of building new roads they are taking the old shortcut.


Based on that I can see that offerings that interest me may actually become plenty (after all money has been made with Linux), which actually makes sense, since no one is irreplaceable.

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underthedeep
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by underthedeep » Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:38 am

this is the best thread i have ever seen in a while, oh my god humans are so funny.

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MOM4Evr
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by MOM4Evr » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:05 am

This is actually kind of cool; I wrote a blog post the other day about this very topic, and I see a lot of people making the same points here I made there. In case anyone is interested: http://retiredsphinx.tumblr.com/post/36 ... aaa-bundle

The tl;dr version would have to be: "Ohman, a different Humble Bundle? I hate difference! Difference bad! Me no like difference!" http://youtu.be/5OB8EYKXAys?t=9m7s

Kame
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by Kame » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:07 am

David wrote:Pros:
Helps charity
Helps people with less money afford a bunch of big games for the holidays
Helps fund the Humble Store and other indie services
Expands the audience for future indie bundles
Could help THQ out of a rough spot
Helps prove that pay-what-you-want can work with big-budget games

Cons:
This particular bundle is Windows-only and has Steam DRM

What do you think would be a better way to handle bundles like this in the future? Should they always have an ultimatum of Linux and DRM-free or nothing, or is there some middle ground for quality games that can't be ported?
Helps charity
Helps people with less money afford a bunch of big games for the holidays (because these haven't all been on sale for less than $5 on steam?)
Helps fund the Humble Store and other indie services (The millions of dollars they've gotten from their other bundles wasn't enough for that?)
Expands the audience for future indie bundles
Could help THQ out of a rough spot
Helps prove that pay-what-you-want can work with big-budget games (helps prove that people don't really care if something is DRM free or not)

Most of your pros are the Pro's of ANY bundle. Which they easily could have done instead. Unless you're implying that HBI is having trouble finding devs who want money?

So, the Pro's of the Humble THQ Bundle are:
Could Help THQ out of a rough-spot
Expands the audience for future indie bundles
Proves that PWYW can work for AAA games (even riddled with DRM and windows only!)

And Cons:
Proves people don't care about DRM
Proves people don't care about cross platform
Proves HBI will completely sell out whatever their original intent was for money

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fenixkane
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by fenixkane » Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:12 pm

The greatest strength of Humble Bundle inc. has always been that 'hard line' that they drew in the dirt.

All games will have Windows, Mac and Linux versions. All games will be DRM free.

I remember reading an earlier post talking about how many developers were denied entry for Humble Bundle 2 because they didn't have a Linux port, even if they had Windows and Mac ports. Why does THQ get a free pass? Because it's hard? It's hard for a lot of indie devs as well, but even if the port isn't complete by the time the bundle starts (and ends) at least they're commited to making the damn port(s).

Humble Bundle inc. built up a lot of brand loyalty because we saw them fighting for DRM free cross-platform releases, but this bundle really shakes that trust. It says, "Well since they're AAA games it's ok. They're first class citizens unlike those indie guys we normally work with."

I know THQ is hurting and on the brink of falling apart and really needs to do something to stay afloat, but this isn't Humble Bundle inc.'s job. THQ could easily do something like this themselves without the support of Humble Bundle inc.

And don't forget that this is right after another Windows only event, The Amnesia Fortnight by DoubleFine. It might seem more forgivable since it's just a quick prototyping event, but these things are starting to set a precedent that, while Humble Indie Bundles will always support all three major platforms and be DRM free, Humble Bundle inc. is willing to bend their initial principals for larger devs and publishers, which hurts trust.

Yes, this helps charity in the short term. I just hope it doesn't weaken future bundles and prevents more money to charity later on. Remember that charity is only the icing on the cake here, not the primary appeal.

I'm not angry, just concerned because I loved what Humble Bundles symbolized, and I'm seeing this symbol being handled very carelessly. Unless I see a pledge from THQ to port the titles in the bundle to Mac & Linux (even a crossover port would be at least an appeasement step) (a source code release would also work, but seems way less likely) and release DRM free downloads I'm not sure if the trust can come back.

TL;DR: I'm concerned and a little sad.

SirPrimalform
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by SirPrimalform » Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:29 pm

David wrote: I'm sure it was a hard decision to make an exception to two of the founding principles of the bundle, and alienate some of the original bundle supporters, but it would have been a mistake to pass up such an important opportunity.

What do you think would be a better way to handle bundles like this in the future? Should they always have an ultimatum of Linux and DRM-free or nothing, or is there some middle ground for quality games that can't be ported?
My problem with this is that it has weakened Humble Bundle's position. Recent bundles prior to this one have featured DRM-free (and cross platform) debuts from games involved. SPAZ and Jamestown for example only became DRM-free because of the bundle. SPAZ had online activation if bought from the developer and Jamestown was Steam exclusive.

Now Humble Bundle's stance has been weakened, some devs may just say "Why do I have to release a DRM-free version of my game? I'll just wait and be in the next Steam only bundle you do".
Sure there'll be DRM-free cross platform bundles, maybe even the majority will be DRM-free and cross platform... but as long as the option to be Steam only in a Humble Bundle exists, the DRM-free movement has lost a powerful ally. One who previously was able to convince developers to remove DRM.*

So... to answer your final question... I think the only way for HB to regain the power they had is to readopt their old stance publicly. I don't mean release a bundle that is DRM-free and cross platform, I mean issue a statement to the effect that there will be no more Steam only Windows bundles.

*I've focussed mainly on the DRM-free aspect as it is closer to my heart, but the cross platform one was just as important overall.

idolminds
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by idolminds » Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:24 pm

When the first tweet went out announcing the THQ bundle and the games in it, I was really excited. "Yes! Finally I can play Saints Row and Darksiders without Steam!" was my very first thought as I clicked the link to the site. Then I saw the Steam requirement and was a little crushed.

Did I build up a false image in my head of what a "Humble Bundle" was? I don't know, maybe. But perhaps the HB people should think about what image and expectations they want to/are building in peoples minds. There are plenty of game bundles online that just pass out Steam keys now, so why should I care about Humble?

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underthedeep
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by underthedeep » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:18 pm

you guys are all just a bunch of assholes

SirPrimalform
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by SirPrimalform » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:24 pm

underthedeep wrote:you guys are all just a bunch of assholes

Clearly we must be. I mean, who calmly puts together a post to explain their concerns..? Only assholes.

Thank you for showing me the light, I now know that to make a point I just need to call those with opposing views assholes.

This man may in fact be the second coming. Such... wisdom and calmness I have never before come across.

Ok, I'll stop with the sarcasm now.

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underthedeep
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by underthedeep » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:50 pm

Image

SirPrimalform
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by SirPrimalform » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:55 pm

underthedeep wrote:Image
Wow, you make my points for me. Thanks!

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adwuga
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by adwuga » Sat Dec 01, 2012 9:08 pm

SirPrimalform wrote:
underthedeep wrote:Image
Wow, you make my points for me. Thanks!
Image

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Aaron
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by Aaron » Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:44 pm

Hey guys, let's try to stay on topic and keep this a mature discussion. Thanks!

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Grayswandir
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by Grayswandir » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:13 pm

If you don't like the idea of giving to a large, non-indie company, just set the entire amount to be given to charity and/or the Humble tip.

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adwuga
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Re: Humble THQ bundle

Post by adwuga » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:50 pm

Aaron wrote:Hey guys, let's try to stay on topic and keep this a mature discussion. Thanks!
Sorry. :(
Grayswandir wrote:If you don't like the idea of giving to a large, non-indie company, just set the entire amount to be given to charity and/or the Humble tip.
Yeah, but their point is that it isn't following Humble Bundle standards, and they are worried this might become more frequent. I agree with David though,
[color=#BF0000]David[/color] wrote:Also, this bundle doesn't replace any indie bundle, it is purely an addition to the bundle schedule. If there were no THQ bundle, there would be no extra money for charity, no major mainstream news event, no exciting new experiment. Given that it was impossible to get the THQ bundle cross-platform and DRM-free, should Humble Bundle have just dropped it and walked away? "Sorry, THQ. Sorry, Red Cross. Sorry, sick children, Sorry, poor gamers. We just can't budge on the Linux thing."
Humble Bundle inc. probably didn't spend much time on this. THQ came to them, saying "Can we have a bundle with these games so we don't die please?" while normally, Humble probably has to go through applications and look for suitable games.

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