Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

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Ragdollmaster
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Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Ragdollmaster » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:38 pm

omigawd

Project Aces is back with some of the sexiest graphics and smoothest gameplay to date. Ace Combat: Assault Horizon is due to come out sometime in 2011 for PS3 and 360.

Trailer is a cinematic orgasm, enjoy what may be the coolest 90 seconds of your day.

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Post by Zhukov » Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:13 am

Meh.

Yet another militaristic gun-wank.

My interest is elsewhere.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by zoidberg rules » Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:22 pm

Second.

Only really interested in flight-sim games if they're really well pulled off.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Ragdollmaster » Tue Sep 07, 2010 3:34 pm

>Yet another militaristic gun-wank.

You do realize that this is part of a series which has been "gun-wanking", as you crudely put it, for quite some time, before everybody started trying to imitate Call of Duty. An AC game can hardly be classified as "yet another _____" when you consider that the series started 15 years ago. Plus, with the exception of Tom Clancy's HAWX, there really aren't any other popular dogfighting games out there that I know off. This isn't a MW/MGS/BF/GTA clone :P

tl;dr don't knock it off before you try it. It's ridiculous. If you don't like "military" games in general, then sure, I can understand not wanting to play a war game, but even then you're including a pretty big swath of the gaming industry as it stands right now and writing a game off as "bad" based on the quality of other games in that genre. Which, when you think about it, is even sillier since games like AC and HAWX play much differently than their ground-based counterparts and can't really be compared to other popular war games that are out right now.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by SamW » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:05 pm

mmmm press triangle to do a cool loop maneuver (whatever that is called) before you get a missile up your ass.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Grayswandir » Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:59 pm

SamW wrote:mmmm press triangle to do a cool loop maneuver (whatever that is called) before you get a missile up your ass.
That was HAWX. No, honestly, they had a button called "Assist" that would lead you by the nose towards whatever you were targeting.

I think my favorite thing about the Ace Combat series, besides all the "jet fighter-wank" (the number of planes they would jam into those games is awesome) is all the ridiculous boss fights. Ace Combat definitely leans towards the arcade side of the "flight-sim" genre.
Project Aces is back with some of the sexiest graphics and smoothest gameplay to date.
This here, this here though, this is just wank. They haven't even put up gameplay trailers yet.

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Post by Zhukov » Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:35 am

We have a bite!
Ragdollmaster wrote:You do realize that this is part of a series which has been "gun-wanking", as you crudely put it, for quite some time...
Yeah, the number 7 on the end kind of tipped me off.
Ragdollmaster wrote:...before everybody started trying to imitate Call of Duty.
"I started eating my own faeces before it was cool. Therefore my eating of faeces is okay."
Ragdollmaster wrote:An AC game can hardly be classified as "yet another _____" when you consider that the series started 15 years ago.
How about "yet another Ace Combat"?
Ragdollmaster wrote:tl;dr don't knock it off before you try it. It's ridiculous.
That depends on exactly what I am knocking. If I were to knock gameplay without having played the game, or at least seen some footage, then you would have a point.

But in this case I am knock the aesthetics and, to a lesser extent, the story and setting. And that trailer gives me all the ammo I need.
Ragdollmaster wrote:If you don't like "military" games in general, then sure, I can understand not wanting to play a war game, but even then you're including a pretty big swath of the gaming industry as it stands right now...
I am perfectly happy to dismiss a big swath of the gaming industry as militaristic gun-wank.
Ragdollmaster wrote:Which, when you think about it, is even sillier since games like AC and HAWX play much differently than their ground-based counterparts and can't really be compared to other popular war games that are out right now.
As mentioned above, it's not the gameplay that gets under my skin.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Renegade_Turner » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:23 am

I generally find these flying games to have a really fucking boring premise, i.e. flying. Piloting is more entertaining in games like GTAIV. Lol

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Re:

Post by Ragdollmaster » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:57 am

Zhukov wrote:"I started eating my own faeces before it was cool. Therefore my eating of faeces is okay."
Wow, what a terrible illustration which fails completely to make your point. At this point, I'm just assuming that you're being coy with me, Mr. Zhukov.
Zhukov wrote:How about "yet another Ace Combat"?
So all series are destined to become bad because after three or so games they all begin blending together, in your mind?
Zhukov wrote: That depends on exactly what I am knocking. If I were to knock gameplay without having played the game, or at least seen some footage, then you would have a point.

But in this case I am knock the aesthetics and, to a lesser extent, the story and setting. And that trailer gives me all the ammo I need.
Are you really? The "aesthetics" could more or less be described as "realistic", which yes, is the status quo for games these days, but what do you expect? Inverted colors and disco paint schemes on all of the planes? It's first and foremost an action-ish arcade game, so the aesthetics match. If it were, say, a horror game, then the aesthetics would be much more somber and dark, but it's clearly not. Atmosphere has to be used in the right place to be effective. As for knocking the story and setting; how? All you know about this is that one of the locations is a city and that there's a war going on. That's about it.
Zhukov wrote:I am perfectly happy to dismiss a big swath of the gaming industry as militaristic gun-wank.
Coo'.


But in short, you're being negative about the general look of the game? Ridiculous. Gameplay is always much different than a launch trailer. Plus, graphics aren't exactly high up on the list of what makes a game good. If a game comes out with the best graphics ever yet the gameplay sucks, nobody will like it. I can understand trying to say, "Oh, I don't like the aesthetics of the game based on the trailer", which is an A-OK statement based on a observation, but you seem to be dismissing the entire game when all you know about it is a 90 second trailer.
R_T wrote:I generally find these flying games to have a really fucking boring premise, i.e. flying. Piloting is more entertaining in games like GTAIV. Lol
Piloting an armed helicopter while drunk can certainly lead to hilarity, usually involving the death of dozens of civilians.

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Re: Re:

Post by Sandurz » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:05 pm

Ragdollmaster wrote:But in short, you're being negative about the general look of the game? Ridiculous.
The same could be said about you orgasming over it.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Ragdollmaster » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:09 pm

I'm orgasming over the graphics, whereas he is hatin' on the game itself based on the graphics.

The reason that I'm anticipating the game itself is because I've always enjoyed the AC series and I like the style of gameplay in the games- I don't expect a game to be fun just because of the graphics.

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Re: Re:

Post by Renegade_Turner » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:57 pm

Ragdollmaster wrote:
Zhukov wrote:"I started eating my own faeces before it was cool. Therefore my eating of faeces is okay."
Wow, what a terrible illustration which fails completely to make your point. At this point, I'm just assuming that you're being coy with me, Mr. Zhukov.
I thought his point was rather precise and well-made, really. He was basically saying that the simple fact that Ace Combat were a pioneer of something shit doesn't make it any less shit, i.e. just because they were doing it first doesn't make it any better.

I'm not saying that's what I think, I'm saying that's what he thinks.

Ragdollmaster wrote:I'm orgasming over the graphics, whereas he is hatin' on the game itself based on the graphics.
The reason that I'm anticipating the game itself is because I've always enjoyed the AC series and I like the style of gameplay in the games- I don't expect a game to be fun just because of the graphics.
I believe that is the point, he's reacting negatively to the look of the game and you're reacting positively to it. What makes his reaction any less legitimate, you're both just experiencing differing reactions to the same stimulus.

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Post by Zhukov » Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:49 am

Ren is entirely correct.

However, "aesthetics" was a a poor choice of words on my part. It isn't the graphics or look of the game that cause me to dismiss it.

Rather, it is the theme. Meatheads in uniform spouting phrases like "aye aye sir, roger that" and "I need a sitrep" while simultaneously defending their apple pie from arbitrarily evil Russians and proudly saluting the stars and stripes. It just doesn't speak to me.

(And it's not just because they're American. A game with Australians defending their meat pie from evil New Zealanders while proudly saluting the southern cross would be just as bad, if not worse.)

Also, war settings tend to indicate lazy writing. See, every story needs conflict of some kind. Whether it take the form of combat, or the struggle to survive in a hostile environment, or even a love triangle, conflict is the core of drama. And of course that conflict requires a plausible cause or justification. And that's where things get complicated. So many writers just say, "Oh fuck it, it's a war, just shoot anything that isn't speaking english." Then knock off for the day.

...

Lastly, watching that trailer causes my inner nitpicker to scream about how modern jet fighters cannot dogfight. They're too fast. Besides, laser-guided and and heat-seeking missiles have rendered dogfighting utterly obsolete. An air-to-air confrontation between modern aircraft would take place at such long range that the pilots wouldn't even be able to see the enemy planes with the naked eye.

So there.

(As per usual, this post ended up much longer then intended.)

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Ragdollmaster » Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:27 pm

What you don't really realize when watching a video/playing a game like Ace Combat is the ridiculous speed of these jets. They literally traverse miles within seconds. Plus, heat-seeking weapons aren't infallible, they can be muddled by flares and dodged by quick air maneuvers. Laser-guided weapons are, as far as I know, non-existent in air-to-air combat. How hard do you think it is to peg a jet moving at mach 2 with a laser long enough for a missile to hit it- when you're on yet another jet moving at nearly the same speed? Even ground-based anti-air defenses, like SAMs, just use thermal and UV sensors. Laser targeting is really only used on stationary buildings and ground vehicles.

Now, yes, dogfighting isn't really that common anymore seeing as ground-air defenses are typically better than air-air in the sense that they are cheaper and constantly operating, unlike jets which have to be (rather expensively) made, fueled, deployed, etc. But there's nothing wrong with today's arsenals that would make dogfighting impossible or even all that hard.

>"Oh fuck it, it's a war, just shoot anything that isn't speaking english." Then knock off for the day.

Typical Ace Combat storyline quality is probably on par with some of the best (whether you like Penumbra, Halo, MGS, Bioshock, or some other epic of a game, it's up there among them) Once again, you're basing the fact that there's a Russian accent in the trailer and a military setting to mean this is a generic modern warfare clone.

Not to mention, this is probably their attempt to freshen the series, as in previous installments, the games have been set in semi-fictional universes with countries like Osea and Yuktobania duking it out, for instance, so a modern one set in the real world is an actual change and sign of innovation. All of the games throughout the series are fairly varied. The first and second are arcade top-down shooters, which are pretty much just the baby steps of the game series (to once again borrow MGS for this example, they're like Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2) The third was the first 3D installment which mixed modern day weaponry and locations with futuristic architecture and a theme focusing on deception, misdirection, etc through electronics. The fourth was semi-futuristic, but not so much as the third, and also mixed in traditional/nostalgic cultures into the storyline. The fifth is, to date, the best insofar as story and emotions go- it's an action junkie and a tearjerker rolled up into a burrito that slams into your face at mach 2. I personally haven't played Zero, 6, or any of the portable installments, but based on reviews and recommendations they're as equally varied and well-thought out as the previous installments.

See, I'm actually basing my viewpoint on past experience and the experiences of a multitude of others, so I can personally attest to the series' quality. I'm sure that you're tired of all the modern-day-ackshun-packed-thrillers coming out these days, but AC7 is almost certainly not one of them (which even I can't say for sure seeing as I haven't played it yet, but what I'm saying more or less is there's a greater chance of it being awesome than terrible)

The military jargon is also part of the theme of AC. It's always been one of those series heavy on details and realism (to reasonable extent) The planes are, to probably within a few pixels, totally accurate in their modeling, and their performances are equally realistic. The fact that the pilots aren't screaming obscenities like leftover grunts from Killzone and Gears of War fits in with the rest of the game's style. Just because the kiddies making games these days feel it's necessary to make the entire dialogue military code doesn't really mean that AC is another bandwagon jumper.

>I thought his point was rather precise and well-made, really. He was basically saying that the simple fact that Ace Combat were a pioneer of something shit doesn't make it any less shit, i.e. just because they were doing it first doesn't make it any better.

Which is applicable if it was shit in the first place. The consensus of probably 90% of people who have played it is that it's not. If everyone jumps off a bridge because one guy did it first, yes, he's still a moron. If everyone, on the other hand, starts adopting children and recycling because one of their neighbors does it, that's a good thing, even if they look like douchebags- but the guy who started it first certainly isn't a douchebag. On the contrary, he is the antithesis of douchebaggery.

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Re: Ace Combat 7 - Assault Horizon

Post by Freshbite » Thu Sep 09, 2010 7:12 pm

Oh god, that Wall O' Text had me running away, screaming like a little girl.

Personally, it may, or may not deserve my interest. I guess that's up to my friends.

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