The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

[Dudeman]

According to Bethesda, its a "burlap-like" material for the premium map. Apparently everyone gets a paper map in the game box and if you preorder you get the extra whatever-material map. But, we'll see when I pick up the game.

Ah. I was under the impression they said that it would be the burlap material for every copy of the game. Just me being misinformed.

[Renegade_Turner]

Honestly, I was considering letting Skyrim pass by, I'm more of a fan of industrial style settings, which are rather rare in (western) RPGs. Sure there's Fallout 3 and New Vegas, but not much else comes to mind (of recent titles) with western RPGs with a modern-ish setting. Which is why I'm more of a fan of japanese RPGs; I get guns with my swords. But, friends of mine kept drooling over Oblivion and saying how awesome it is, so I figured I'd try the newer fancier "Oblivion" and not have to deal with the Gamebryo engine.

Ditto ditto ditto ditto. Not enough RPG's (GOOD ones) with guns. This medieval fantasy lark has almost overstayed its welcome in terms of RPG's for me. But Skyrim is going to be such a well-done and overall deep game that I won't even give a shit. The Elder Scrolls games are pretty much the only ones that will do it for me now.

[Dudeman]

Ditto ditto ditto ditto. Not enough RPG's (GOOD ones) with guns. This medieval fantasy lark has almost overstayed its welcome in terms of RPG's for me. But Skyrim is going to be such a well-done and overall deep game that I won't even give a shit. The Elder Scrolls games are pretty much the only ones that will do it for me now.

The engine they've built for Skyrim looks as if it'd be well suited to their probable next game, Fallout 4. AKA, an RPG with guns. I've heard tell on the interwebs that it might be set in New York.

In other news, the crafting system in Skyrim looks amazing. Like a well polished version of the system many MMORPG's have adopted.
Damn, I can't wait to see what modders will do with this game.

[Renegade_Turner]

Oh, I've already acknowledged Fallout. But that's the only game. Hasn't Fallout already been mentioned anyway? The difference is, while Bethesda are the only people at the moment that seem to be able to make the old-style fantasy game work, it wouldn't take a lot for me to enjoy another RPG set in modern times. I enjoyed the shit out of Deus Ex Human Revolution.

In other news, Bethesda tried to get an injunction on Notch to stop him having a game named "Scrolls". What a pack of dickheads.

[Zhukov]

Out of curiosity, what were your thoughts on DX:HR?

As for that lawsuit thing, as I understand it they're legally obligated to do it... sort of.

See, according to US copyright law, if you don't defend your trademarks then you can lose the rights to them. So they're kicking up a fuss now over the Scrolls business in order to retain the ability to kick up a fuss in case someone decides to make Old Scrolls: Cloud Rhyme. A thoroughly stupid situation all round.

[Dudeman]

Oh, I've already acknowledged Fallout. But that's the only game. Hasn't Fallout already been mentioned anyway?

Ah. I didn't see that Gray mentioned it.

In other news, Bethesda tried to get an injunction on Notch to stop him having a game named "Scrolls". What a pack of dickheads.

As for that lawsuit thing, as I understand it they're legally obligated to do it... sort of.

This was my understanding of the situation as well.
Besides, the people actually filing the lawsuit wouldn't be any of the people who work on the games. I assume the company has the legal branch handle that kind of thing.

The difference is, while Bethesda are the only people at the moment that seem to be able to make the old-style fantasy game work, it wouldn't take a lot for me to enjoy another RPG set in modern times. I enjoyed the shit out of Deus Ex Human Revolution.

I do agree with the sentiment, but for now I'm also fairly happy with the swarm of medieval fantasy. While most of it is terrible, a few shine through.
An era of futuristic RPGs would be amazing, though.

[Ragdollmaster]

Heh. This was pretty much my reaction to the teaser originally.

[Zhukov]

Got to play my housemate's copy for an hour or so.

The good news: It gave the opportunity to confirm my impressions.

The bad news: It confirmed my impressions.

The outdoor scenery is very nice. Seriously, it can't be said enough, the landscapes are fantastic. And yes, the dragons are pretty cool, albeit rather visually generic. Apart from that, it's just Fallout 3 with a less interesting setting and lots of awkward fantasy words that the actors struggle to pronounce with a straight face. The combat is terrible and the animation looks like something from the pre-Half Life 2 years. The characters move and fight like puppets and don't gesture when they speak, so you get NPCs trying to direct your attention to "That thief over there", while sitting completely still and never breaking eye contact.

Granted, I didn't get that long of a go, but the intro was bizarrely lacking. "You were expecting a big open fantasy world? Fuck you buddy, here's a linear a cave."

Oh yeah, and bugs. It kept crashing on every second loading screen and the scripting didn't seem to be working like it should have. Twice the NPC who was supposed to be guiding me got stuck on a staircase and just started spinning around on the spot until I reloaded the game.

Skyrim ladies and gentlemen, Game of the Year... or so I was told.

Back when that first voiceover teaser hit the wires I was unimpressed but mildly curious. Then the actual trailer came out and I was positively excited. Now I've seen it in action and my opinion has plummeted straight to "meh" level. I'll consider grabbing a copy of my own when I see it in a bargain bin or Steam sale.

[Ragdollmaster]

I watched a 3 hour long gameplay video of it on the 360 a few days back and didn't notice any glitches other than a floating sword. Out of curiosity, what version were you playing?

Combat seems much like Oblivion but with better spells, dual-wielding, bows being actually useful, and finishing moves which aren't a huge deal but do look very nice. I never had much of a problem with it, and frankly, while I wish it were better, I don't really see how it could be really improved since it's mostly melee based. There's hitting, there's blocking, there's that awkward moment where you both swing your swords at the same time and just deflect each other- I suppose some counters or preset melee moves/skills would work, but other than that, I can't think of much. Thoughts on this?

Fallout's intro was pretty linear, too. You had to go through Vault 101 before experiencing the big fantasy world. Same in Oblivion with escaping the jail/sewer. You can't really plop somebody out in the open in an open world game- there's usually some incentive objective at the beginning to get them started. The only open world game I've seen where you're not explicitly given anything to do from the beginning is Minecraft

That said, combat is certainly not the focus of the game. It's kind of just there. Fighting for the sake of fighting can be alright, but certainly not exhilarating. It is a huge, open world, a very nice-looking one at that, and there are dungeons to loot, secret areas to discover, potions to make, spells to learn, books to read, and guilds to join; I don't think it's any one component that makes playing an Elder Scrolls game so fun, but the entire experience is really unique and a massive time sink when you can get into it.

I do agree that the character facial animations and lack of gestures could be improved on. Sometimes in a conversation, depending on whether you or the NPC you're talking to mention something to make them happy/sad/angry/whatever, their expression changes to reflect that, but the transitions are really obvious and unnatural. Not a huge deal for me, really, but it's little details like that that can add to or take away from the immersion in the game- and immersion is really important in a game like TES.

[Zhukov]

- It was the 360 version.

- Saying combat isn't a big part of Skyrim is like saying jumping isn't a big part of Mario. It's essentially the bread-and-butter activity of the game. You go to a place, you kill everything that attacks you, take their stuff and move on. You could probably do a non-combat run by abusing the stealth (lol) system or some kind of stun/freeze spell, but you'd have to skip most of the content and it would be many times faster to just hack everything out of your way.

- How could it be improved? Christ, how could it not? Combos? Special ability-based moves? Directional swings, thrusts and blocks a la Mount and Blade? Light-medium-heavy attacks? You bloody name it. Damn near anything would be an improvement over "damage with left hand, damage with right", or if you're really feeling creative, "damage with right, block with left".

- Yeah, Vault 101 was weak as well. It was all story-based, which is fine, but Bethesda can't write worth a damn and their NPCs can't deliver a line to save their lives, which is why I took to shooting everyone before they could irritate me with their asinine dialogue. But at least it built up to that big moment where you saw the wastes for the first time.

[Renegade_Turner]

Granted, I didn't get that long of a go, but the intro was bizarrely lacking. "You were expecting a big open fantasy world? Fuck you buddy, here's a linear a cave."

What a whiney thing to complain about, considering that's pretty much how you begin every single fantasy RPG game before you can get a taste of the map world, from the Final Fantasy series to the Elder Scrolls series to the Fallout series.

I can take people's opinions, but I can't shake the feeling that you just love complaining for the sake of complaining.

[Ragdollmaster]

- How could it be improved? Christ, how could it not? Combos? Special ability-based moves? Directional swings, thrusts and blocks a la Mount and Blade? Light-medium-heavy attacks? You bloody name it. Damn near anything would be an improvement over "damage with left hand, damage with right", or if you're really feeling creative, "damage with right, block with left".

There are already strong/power attacks, which are directional. Holding down the attack button with a melee weapon initiates a power attack and there're five variants- standing still, moving forward, moving backward, moving left, and moving right. I didn't really like M&B's system to be honest. It was neat but looked horrendous and the response when you would actually hit something felt terrible and weak. I honestly prefer Skyrim's melee combat to M&B's. If you think about it, how significant would that really be, honestly? The difference between a left or right direction slash? As for combos, how do you implement combos into a game like TES, other than "mash attack repeatedly?" Light/heavy attacks are already there. So again, special ability-based moves are about the only thing I can think of.

I can take people's opinions, but I can't shake the feeling that you just love complaining for the sake of complaining.

Also, this.

[Freshbite]

I'll consider grabbing a copy of my own when I see it in a bargain bin or Steam sale.

+1.

I can take people's opinions, but I can't shake the feeling that you just love complaining for the sake of complaining.

I want to hear him complain about 'Modern Warfare 2.5', as it's being called.

[Zhukov]

Ren:
Yes, that complaint is rather nitpick-y. But I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the intro to a game to be, y'know... good. Especially a high budget game from a veteran studio that has been hyped to high heaven and has apparently caused every nerd on the planet to experience spontaneous erections. Skyrim's intro lovingly showcases its lousy character animation, gives you a preview of an admittedly cool dragon, then let's you spend 20 minutes slogging through a tunnel. Maybe I've just been spoiled by the likes of Mass Effect 2 and Portal 2, but that shit was severely lacking.

Also, I notice you ignored several paragraphs of criticism to pick on the shortest and least fleshed out point you could find.

And yes, I am complaining for the sake of complaining. Why else would I do it? But no, I don't love doing it. I'd rather be getting immense enjoyment from the game and ecstatically praising it. That's much more fun.

Eh, I guess I'm just experiencing 'hype backlash'.

Ragdoll:
You're right, I missed the heavy attacks. However, the directional stuff is purely visual. The various attacks don't add to the gameplay mechanics. All the fights I experienced consisted of walking up to an enemy and listlessly tapping the attack button until they flop over, maybe blocking every now and again when my attacking finger gets tired, and chugging health potions as neccesary. It makes me wish there was an auto-attack option. That way I could at least read the papers while my character drearily hacks away at enemy health bars.

In short, I cannot see how this is a good combat system, and I certainly can't see it staying interesting for the duration of a game that is intended to last dozens of hours at bare minimum.

Freshbite:
I'll have to disappoint you. I don't really hate CoD. I think the game's multiplayer at least is actually rather well made. It just happens to not be to my tastes. Not buying MW3, although I'll watch an LP to see the set pieces and find out which protagonists die this time.

[Freshbite]

I'm far from disappointed. Frankly, I'm glad that you haven't followed the 'trend' of bashing the game, and that you see it from your own perspective. Metacritic users has recently been rating it unfairly, I don't really know what their real intentions are, but it seems to me to be too drastic of a move. People have been saying that it's the "Battlefield 3's fanbase" doing, but I doubt that.

I haven't played the game much myself, but from what I've seen, it looks like a pretty generic shooter.


In other news, some people of the Metacritic userbase are nothing but immature, but this is hilarious:

Rating: 0/10
"GET MW2 is low expansive and is better. activision/blizar like a good stats ok 0/10 .i a fanboy COD but mw3 is not good for 2 year of developpement . 2year for the game or elite suck 50$ activision noob."