Unique Weapon Idea and Mechanic

[fraywing]

This may or may not have been suggested, after purchasing and playing Overgrowth, I'm extremely pleased with everything about the alpha. Its fantastic.

One thing that particularly stood out to me is the great physics and physics related functionality and motifs (think throwing knife)

I never really suggest ideas for development, because as a dev myself I understand that vision is unique. However, I feel impressed to formally suggest a subjectively unique weapon idea that would be loads of fun and would fit in (my opinion) with the universe of Overgrowth.

The Bolas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolas

A brief description of how it could be implemented:
The player would start spinning the bolas above the head until proper speed is attained.
After releasing, the bolas would fly at a moderate to slow speed toward an enemy.
When the spinning projectile comes in contact with an enemy, a calculation is made determining
which part of the body the weapon has made contact with. When the bolas hits the upper part of an enemy, it temporarily subdues his arms, effectively inhibiting attack for a duration until the bolas breaks. (the enemy would still be able to move/run)
Secondarily, the bolas for wrap the enemies legs and trip them.

I think it would be awesome to have this weapon in game because it is a rather unique and functionality could be dynamic.

Any takers?

[John147GHN]

I take it. It would be a nice addition to have non-lethal weapons for variety.

Imagine you are in a stealth mission and then you use that "bolas" thing and nulify your enemy's legs, so you think you are safe to continue, but then he screams and all the other guards automatically enter in alert mode.

[fraywing]

That's a great idea! Interesting that it wouldn't completely subdue them, since they could still yell out and alert their mates.

It would have to be a temporary effect, perhaps the reeds or rope breaks after a set time divided by the enemy's aggression stat or another.

As pointed out, it would be nice to have a non-lethal method of subdue. Especially for sneak attacks, but rather than a generic (since Overgrowth is obviously not such) the unique aspects of the bolas seem prime candidate.

Having the ability to either bind their attack or movement based on which part of their body it hits would be a must.

[scottojr]

Maybe even make it so that they go into a new ragdoll mode when the bolos hit them. So that if they are moving they will hit the ground roll a bit then sit there and try to break the ropes with their hands.

[kehaar]

Fun idea! I love the non-lethal end of it for story telling, that it's a ranged weapon, but only for as far as you can throw it...

Plus you could use it to bring down fleeing enemies, like it's used to hunt in real life. I guess-- with a lot of work of course-- you might also implement it in game as a flail-style club, like a morningstar mace or nunchuku. You would have to do some fun animations for fights, and maybe to make the tethers and weights of the weapon ragdoll if they missed or were dropped-- how cool would that look?!

Another step would be (instead of throwing it) to be able to wrap a line around an enemy's arm or leg or head while keeping a grip on the other end or it: you could yank on it to trip or throw someone.
I guess if you could make that, you'd then have the possibility of ropes and whips.

[Andrige]

Okay, if there's only going to be one purely ranged weapon then it should be this. A good way to disable one enemy in a group before the combat begins (the advantage being that the bola doesn't occupy a hand-slot).

*thumbs up*

[KILLTHIS]

I like the idea. Easy and effective. Maybe there could be two kinds of it?

First one: Short, just to immobilize enemies quickly.

Second one: Added rope, so the enemy can be dragged around. Would be interesting. Imagine two rooftops, divided by a little gap; Enemy sees the player and wants to run away, the player just throws it, grabs him and drags him back to him - or maybe the player fixates the enemy onto on point with the enlarged rope.

[Korban3]

Bolas are something I'd enjoy seeing, but the technical side is daunting. Animating a bolas and it's physical use would be hell. I didn't expect throwing knives to do all their spins and aiming purely through physics like they do, so I wouldn't be surprised that if bolas were put in, it would be done entirely with physics controlling the action and target reaction. That's what really throws a stick in the spokes because animating ropes and weights that interact with a characters legs, the characters legs get tangled up properly and then the character attempting to get out of the mess would be amazing, but extremely difficult.
If David ever did this and got it working using just the physics and procedural animation, I'd probably have to drop dead for a few minutes to avoid implosion by awesomeness.

[fraywing]

If David ever did this and got it working using just the physics and procedural animation

I completely agree on the technical side of things. In fact, one way of implementing it without overstepping the difficult barrier of keeping things in active physics, would be to have the actual projectile portion of the bola be entirely procedural.

That way you could have the spinning projectile be a static model and animation determined by velocity and such. If it came in contact with terrain or a prop, it would transition into active physics and with a dampener, you could make the actual calculations be lessened by quickly ending physical movement and thus ending the calculations.

As for contact with an enemy, as soon as it contacts the hit box, the closest bolas "end piece" would need to become a rigid prop connected to he model, then the velocity calculation would have to be done to determine the wrapper procedure of the other end piece, as well as the connecting rope.

A low poly rope is pretty easy to simulate, you just have to quickly dampen it to free up resources.

I like the idea. Easy and effective. Maybe there could be two kinds of it?

First one: Short, just to immobilize enemies quickly.

That's a cool idea. The distance could even be determined by the rope length between the bola.

A good way to disable one enemy in a group before the combat begins (the advantage being that the bola doesn't occupy a hand-slot).

Right, you could quickly get rid of it, and then charge in with your weapon or melee!

Another step would be (instead of throwing it) to be able to wrap a line around an enemy's arm or leg or head while keeping a grip on the other end or it: you could yank on it to trip or throw someone.

Thats interesting, you'd almost have to have some sort of static net idea as well if you went that direction, capture your prey!

Maybe even make it so that they go into a new ragdoll mode when the bolos hit them. So that if they are moving they will hit the ground roll a bit then sit there and try to break the ropes with their hands.

I was thinking this as well, it would be cool to have a temporary way to immobilize an enemy from a distance. Perhaps depending on a stat (or maybe even if they have a weapon in hand) they could free themselves after a duration.

All great ideas guys!

[Kolega]

The Overgrowth game really should have nunchucks as a weapon. Use it to hit enemies and throw on their legs maybe to cause similar effect like bolas, just to sweep them. But the main thing about nunchucks would be to get that japan ninja style feeling, which the rabbits in this game breathe.

[Korban3]

Nunchucks have been brought up before as well. The same problem arises when you try to animate this in a video game:

It exhibits a host of things you can do with nunchaku that you cannot efficiently animate and program in a game. You can do static attack animations, but people will be disappointed because you won't be able to do everything in-game that you could with them in real life.

[Kolega]

Well, if you think that chain's animations would be hard to make, I think that it is possible to make them behave like ropes.

[Endoperez]

It's relatively simple to have the weapon follow physics. It's very hard to make animations that work when the weapon is simulated like that. You know how real-life people sometimes hit themselves with nunchucks? The AI would probably do that all the time, because the starting position is slightly different each time, and then the physics come in, and the end result is different too.

[kehaar]

It seems like you'd just want set animations for a few different strikes or grapples or ranged throws, like you have for any other weapon or limb. Having it set up to rely on in game physics for strikes probably would result in a lot of hitting yourself, just like in real life.

Where the ragdoll would look cool is when you dropped it, or after you hit something by throwing it, in the case of bolos.

[Doggyhugger]

Lawlz, Im argentinian so I think this could be cool.
Let me say that that, depending on the running speed of the target, or the bodyparts the boleadoras hit, they can be very deadly, imagine two or three balls made of iron being swung towards your head, ouch!
Oh and the animation should be shown with the character swinging them above it's head, least it hits itself.