fighting multiple opponents

Homocidal Ham · Post by **Homocidal Ham** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:14 pm

I've noticed that all of the moves in lugaru are geared toward single combat, yet most of the game makes you fight multiple enemies

the way it could be: when two or more enemies are with in (or if you and one or more of your friends if you have them the enemy could do this) range you could hit jump+attack a double spin kick, which would have a delay long enough to let your enemies (or you and your friends) cartwheel and would be the only non-reversable move. This wouldn't mean you don't have to fight multiple opponents, it would just make them think twice before just trying to overpower you with shear numbers. To make sure the game dosn't become chuck norris style, your enemies would storm you while your attacking one opponent, and they would sometimes all just try to take you down in a very sudden movment just before you could get a spin kick off forcing you to retreat, which would make the swarm option available, but not as much of an immediate "yes"

you could also attack another individual in mid reversal (on leg sweap it would be like:step on enemy foot, elbow guy behind you, uppercut)wouldn't be defensless if you counter some one

JLrep · Post by **JLrep** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:09 pm

Or you could, like, you know, throw one enemy at another...

Zantalos · Post by **Zantalos** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 12:08 am

I don't like reversal combo moves, or any combos. The controlls for Lugaru were intuative and and easy to pull off. Fluent attacks are cool, maybe even some combos, so long as it's not hecka complicated so you have the ability to direct Turner the whole time (which wouldn't really be a combo at all since you could stop at any time and do the moves whenever you wanted. Or maybe it could be a combo, by changing the attack right after a specific attck had been executed. That's usually how it always is then... doing a left punch right after you did a right punch.).

And as for special attacks that are only meant for two people (or multiple people?), I think the engine aleardy fixes this problem. Not only will ragdoll bodies hit people, but your body will too (no really, this didn't happen before... Oh yeah well, except for that leg cannon). Meaning, if you did a legsweep it would not only hit your intended target, but every one who happened to be in the way as well (Since, all the attacks and movements are physics based animations, not just preset animations like in normal games, models hitting models now has an actual effect ion gameplay).

At least I think that's how physics based animations would work, David would have to confirm this, since he's the one who has to do all the programming by himself

zip · Post by **zip** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 12:21 am

Zantalos wrote:(Since, all the attacks and movements are physics based animations, not just preset animations like in normal games, models hitting models now has an actual effect ion gameplay).

Erm... I'm pretty sure that's called "collision detection", and most games have it ;p

Zantalos · Post by **Zantalos** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 1:05 am

Well a bunch of games do have spread out damage but it's not like real collision damage. Like in Godfather, doing a bunch of punches at an opponent has a chance of hitting nearby opponents as well. But I think it doesn't have anything to do with your arm model hitting the enemy, it's just a bunch of fake splash damage stuff. I think the difference between Lugaru 2 is that it uses physics to back up everything it does.

And that's a huge step for games in general, and for Wolfire games too! Normally like in blackshades, you could only target a single enemy with a melee attack, and the same with Lugaru (Man, I still can't believe Blackshades was the first 3rd person FPS). Now, it's everything that hits your body! That's hecka awesome dude!

JLrep · Post by **JLrep** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:00 am

^I assume you base your calling Black Shades a "3rd-person FPS" on the fact that the whole point of the game was to protect the white dude, and you couldn't even die?

And, Ham, you mentioned the theoretical spin move as the only non-reversable attack - well, I hate to break it to you, but in realistic terms, it doesn't get any more "reversable" than a jumping spin-kick.

benjags · Post by **benjags** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:08 am

Zantalos wrote:...Man, I still can't believe Blackshades was the first 3rd person FPS)...

you mean a third person first person shooter???? and that would be what??

Zantalos · Post by **Zantalos** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 4:57 pm

Ok, normally games like doom or Call of duty 2 don't relate at all to what you actually see. You will do something like a melee attack, but every one else will see you do some other type of attack, your gun will point right at someone's face but they will see it point in some other direction; and this is how most games are.

Next-gen games however, (or at least the Brothers in Arms people) are calling this new style a 3rd person FPS. (Hey I think Tresspasser was like this too) The characters are all animated in, and then the camera is put right where you eyes would be. So instead of the gun swaying animation that you see but nobody else sees, everything going on in your view is going on in the real game too. It makes things like the disarm move and dive moves alot more insane to do.

wormguy · Post by **wormguy** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:11 pm

Zantalos wrote:Ok, normally games like doom or Call of duty 2 don't relate at all to what you actually see. You will do something like a melee attack, but every one else will see you do some other type of attack, your gun will point right at someone's face but they will see it point in some other direction; and this is how most games are.

Next-gen games however, (or at least the Brothers in Arms people) are calling this new style a 3rd person FPS. (Hey I think Tresspasser was like this too) The characters are all animated in, and then the camera is put right where you eyes would be. So instead of the gun swaying animation that you see but nobody else sees, everything going on in your view is going on in the real game too. It makes things like the disarm move and dive moves alot more insane to do.

Yeah, I think FEAR used that technique. I hope more devs start using it too.

JLrep · Post by **JLrep** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 9:21 pm

Ah, I see. I guess it somewhat works to call it a 3rd person FPS - but only in relation to mainstream FPSes (eventually that term will become silly as technology allows all FPSes to use that technique).

The only other game I can think of that does this is Breakdown for the Xbox, which was - for those who don't know - actually an entirely 1st-person fighting game, complete with kicks, rolls, flips, and getting knocked off your feet.