Suggesions [by Murfle] (AI, Thrown, Animation, Other)

[Murfle]

Okay, a little intro first - thanks to GameTrailers I've come across this wonderful game in the making, and i was so excited and amazed by the amount of love and care put into it that I've decided to watch all the videos on your YouTube channel. Very... VERY impressive. That, as a generally creative person made me see a few flaws, things I'd try to do differently, that sort of thing.

So after going trough all the videos (some multiple times) I decided I need to share my ideas & opinions here... because we all know opinions matter on the Internet... Right?

Anyway, heres a small list of my suggestions:

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Blood (triangle by triangle, character surface) - Video: "Overgrowth Alpha 128 changes"

The blood system shown here is realistic and works for the most part, the only problem is the surface dripping - the flow down the body creates straight, clean edges that look very unrealistic, especially when crossing from say - clothing to fur.

My suggestion - give characters an "Armor Map". An overlaying texture that determines what the material is on a certain part of a characters surface. Fur,Cloth,Leather, you know what I mean. Then simply make the blood calculate directions it will NOT spread in (calculate the edges) as its flowing, and make a more stain like texture at those spots. Basically blur the line. The stain must differ depending on what the surface is - cloth and fur are more "blurry", where leather can have clean lines like the ones already shown in the video. Blood on metal pieces may also be shinier than on other surfaces. Finally, the tint of the blood must be darkened depending on the surface its on.Example - Blood on darker wolf fur must be darker than the one splattered on a white/light brown bunny.

The tinting (and perhaps the soak up effect) may also be used and applied to blood on the ground.

The "Armor Map" might also help when you're doing damage/collision detection for better weapons or fall damage (You probably have a system for this in place already so it might be able to expand on that, but I'm guessing thats model, not surface based.)

Downside to all of this would be possible slowdowns when a lot of blood is being spilled.


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The Tail (and some animation ideas)

I've gotten a good look at the protagonists backside thanks to all the videos, and my complaint would be - the tail seems to stretch a tad bit too far when running, causing it to look rather strange. I could be wrong, since I haven't preordered (yet) and don't have the chance to check out the model animations myself.

As long as we're on the subject of animation - Idea: If you do any sort of attempt at displaying emotions - use the ears.

Idle/Patrolling - ears are at an angle, showing a relaxed posture. Some ears might bend down at half or completely when in this relaxed state.

Alertness - when a guard hears a slight sound his ears twitch upwards and turn in the direction it came from, after that he tilts his head to see the spot what he heard with one eye much like a real rabbit, and only then, if the spot is beyond his line of sight, or upon seeing something of interest, devotes his full attention. (When searching he may stop in place and listen to his surroundings by tilting his head to cover the angles behind him, and twitching his ears in various directions.)
(AI idea - make the guards quickly jump to & use a more elevated location for a lookout point, and make this their default action when first becoming suspicious. - They may also use an elevated location upon loosing direct eyesight.)


Sadness/Fear/Shock - When hurt, (or perhaps during cutscenes) the character drops his ears further downwards than usual. All animals do this, much like a human frowns. This together with eyes widely opened or completely shut, may prove to portray a wide array of things that may be going on in the character's head. His "state" if you will.

I think this paragraph of mine alone is enough to give you an idea of what kind of "stealthy" elements I had in mind for the game's AI as far as guards searching for a lawbreaker goes. I don't know that much about the game, so I hope the stuff I've typed isn't a complete miss.
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Thrown Weapons

I've heard that bows and crossbows are a no-no as far as the authors are concerned, but weapons that are more effective as projectiles might still prove to be interesting. My Idea: Give us the ability to swing our mouse while holding down the "projectile button" and releasing it. Much like what the weapon pick-up system was in one of the videos (don't know if this has changed) this will give a potentially hard, but generally satisfying thrown weapon system. Allow the protagonist to carry only a very small amount of these, and of course - make them stick into bodies (a use for my "Armor Map" idea combined with the Weapon Sharpness overlays you've got going?), while still being retrievable after the character used for a pin cushion is dead.

- The protagonist being able to shove or maybe even drag/carry a body would be very useful for turning them over to retrieve these weapons... in case the parts they were sticking from would be facing the ground. This would, again - add some interesting stealth mechanics. (I swear to god I'm not trying to turn this into a stealth game, but the ideas I'm having as I type this are just sorta leading me towards it.)

Idea: Carrying/holding an enemy may cause enemy thrown weapons to get stuck in their ragdoll instead of you.

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Smell - (Wolves/Dogs) Video: "Overgrowth Alpha 123"

- Same as with your Sound system shown in this video, It would be really easy to make the dogs and especially wolves very smell based. Make all characters leave a two part trail of smell behind them. One part represents the vapor - it slowly elevates and becomes less intense, but is initially large.(Make the character emit large "smell globe" meshes at a static interval, that slowly shrink in diameter. This means that a faster moving character is harder to follow.) The other part is left on the terrain based on footsteps, and takes MUCH longer to evaporate (depending on terrain). If a smell is picked up by a wolf, he will become alert, and attempt to follow it. If he picks up the other - terrain based trail he will be able to follow at a quicker pace. You may also give him the ability to track with footprints as a last resort if the terrain is right, and if the smells have evaporated.

Idea: (I swear this stuff keeps popping into my head, and I just cant stop typing.) If there are other animal smells in the area the tracker may lose your scent. Same for when crossing (potential?) streams or bodies of water, or certain terrain.



Thats that for now. Whew. I'm tired and I'm done, but I'll post again if anything pops up in my head. I'd be very happy to see some feedback regarding my ideas, and I'm looking forward to more videos, and the day of Overgrowth's release.

[Endoperez]

Thrown Weapons

I've heard that bows and crossbows are a no-no as far as the authors are concerned

Nice suggestions. However, I don't remember the devs saying outright that they won't be doing bows or crossbows. The last blog postabout ranged weapons was a few years ago. While it leans that way at least in my opinion, things might have changed. Personally I'd rather not see bows and crossbows in the base game, because they can be used at such a huge range.

[LookforAI]

I like the idea of the Smell !! However, I only wish that the wolf has ability to smell, not the rabbit. Since if all animals have ability of smell, then the smell system must overwhelm the sound system. That means that whether you make sound or not, whether you appear on their sight, the enemy always can find you.

[barbiebedia]

the smell changes are a really good idea:)

but what can i do if i out of weapons?

[Korban3]

Use your fists, of course. That's what they're there for: BEATING THE CRAP OUTTA STUFF!

[bujuman]

I love the smelling idea, dogs and wolves should be able to use them!

I wonder what amazing senses does other animals have?!?
Cats - they can see in the dark really good.
Rabbits - good hearing and jumping.
Rats - Able to parkour really good?
Wolves - they can run really fast.

[Korban3]

Don't forget that rats have a respectable sense of smell as well as uber stealth skillz!

[Stranger]

I like the idea of introducing smell as well, it's something I've thought about for awhile now. I think it would be interesting if how the senses work, as far as sight/sound/smell goes, functioned a little different with each race.

As mentioned, wolves and dogs would have a superior sense of smell than the others. Cats could have superior vision, night vision in particular - if you were to have the dark hamper the vision of the NPCs, cats could be the least effected by it. Rabbits, of course, don't have those ears for nothing, and could have superior hearing. Rats are a little harder, since they don't have as clear of a superior sense, but you could have them have mid range senses; like better smelling than rabbits and cats, but not dogs and wolves, and better vision/night vision than all but cats.

There's also the thought about how these senses function. Right now I think there's a sort of standard, conical, forward facing sight range, if I'm not mistaken. But it might be interesting to change this up depending on the race. Rabbits and rats have eyes on the sides of their heads, and thus do have good peripheral vision, they can see most of the way around them. Cats, dogs, and wolves on the other hand, have binocular vision with their eyes in front, giving depth better perception. This variation could be implemented in the game, with rabbits and rats seeing in a wider arc, while the cats, dogs, and wolves' depth perception being translated maybe into distance vision. So the predators can see you from farther away, with the prey animals being more aware of their immediate surroundings.