Portal 2

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Renegade_Turner
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Re: Portal 2

Post by Renegade_Turner » Tue Apr 19, 2011 8:58 am

Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
There's something key here in your post. I can't quite figure out what it is.

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Blorx » Tue Apr 19, 2011 9:32 am

Assaultman67 wrote:
Grayswandir wrote:...So I give you this:
You have a job, you see a product you want, take the time to save up for it. If you really want it that badly, you'll take the time to save up for it in a reasonable way that won't put you in a hole.
But what about all those things you kinda want but have decided it wasn't worth the money?

Sure, the amount of suffering caused by your desire isn't much because you decided its not worth the money. But its still there and this happens for 100's of products.

(also, this is more of a rant towards all advertising in general than a specific rant at valve. Valve just triggered it with their highly original way of saying "Be sure to drink your ovaltine!")

(LOL ... socially acceptable trolling)
I think this might sum it up nicely.

Image

But see, the issue is that your argument seems to be about ads being everywhere and ads being the whole cause of this issue, whereas, people aren't really pissed about advertisements, people are pissed because they thought there was some huge scheme to make Portal 2 a runaway success right out of the gates, when, in fact, it was just a scheme to sell a bunch of games by starting the Potato Sack and letting it ride on Portal 2's success.

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Post by Zhukov » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:42 am

You experience suffering when you see advertising?

Wow.

So... how exactly do you surive in a modern urban society?

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Assaultman67 » Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:30 am

Blorx wrote:... But see, the issue is that your argument seems to be about ads being everywhere and ads being the whole cause of this issue, whereas, people aren't really pissed about advertisements, people are pissed because they thought there was some huge scheme to make Portal 2 a runaway success right out of the gates, when, in fact, it was just a scheme to sell a bunch of games by starting the Potato Sack and letting it ride on Portal 2's success.
grr ... im segway-ing to a broader topic dammit! pay attention :P :lol:

This rant started from "the potato sack" fiasco and the TF2 store because it was an exceptionally good example of aggressive advertising.
Renegade_Turner wrote:
Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
Assaultman67 wrote:...and this happens for 100's of products.
There's something key here in your post. I can't quite figure out what it is.
You're right, its more like millions (billions?) of products. (I said 100's because thats probably how many times I've thought personally have consciously thought "I want that, but not bad enough to pay ___ for it")
Zhukov wrote:You experience suffering when you see advertising?

Wow.

So... how exactly do you surive in a modern urban society?
What I'm saying is that advertisements perpetuate the consumerist attitude of gaining happiness from material possession. Hence, no material possession = no happiness = suffering

All this advertising exposure compounds together making the majority of the population unsatisfied with what they already have and driving them to continue to seek out more things that will please them only temporarily.

and they're everywhere and completely unavoidable.

Which begs the question ... why the hell is society like this?

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Blorx » Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:02 pm

Assaultman67 wrote: What I'm saying is that advertisements perpetuate the consumerist attitude of gaining happiness from material possession. Hence, no material possession = no happiness = suffering

All this advertising exposure compounds together making the majority of the population unsatisfied with what they already have and driving them to continue to seek out more things that will please them only temporarily.

and they're everywhere and completely unavoidable.

Which begs the question ... why the hell is society like this?
Because society is too deeply rooted in economy.

Can we get back to talking about Portal 2 now? They have a whopping collective 4.7 out of 10 on Metacritic right now.

http://kotaku.com/#!5793543/the-people- ... g-portal-2

I have to agree. The original Portal, barely over 3 hours was a bargain because it came in the Orange Box, and was pretty much considered the free game that came with all the other games that people held a little more highly.

Now, priced at $50-$60, Portal 2, maybe only twice the length of Portal, is asking money for ridiculous things like co-op gestures and skins? These should be in-game unlockables, not microtransactions!

They have a right to be pissed, methinks. At the same time, though, you don't need these, and further at the same time, this gives us a chance to decide whether it's worth sticking around with Valve for further stupidity like this.

EDIT: Looks like it's going back up but my points remain.
http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/portal-2

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Assaultman67 » Tue Apr 19, 2011 1:24 pm

Hmm ... i wonder if i can refund my game :? :P

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Post by Zhukov » Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:29 pm

*sigh*

Blorx, have you even played it?

Because your facts are all over the place. For a start, the single player is just over three times the length of Portal 1. Then there's the co-op on top of that.

Also, $50-$60? I got it off Steam for $45.

As for the DLC, I don't see the problem. It's just hats, coloured skins and funny gesture animations. Completely unneccesary stuff. Not having them doesn't detract from the game.

The Metacritic thing is due to an amazon-bomb style swoop by the folks at /v/. A pack of entitled dipshits with a pathetic little axe to grind. Note that the critics, y'know, the people who actually do this for a living, are giving it an average of 96.

In conclusion, the game is good. It has everything that made the original awesome and then some more. The only problem, if you can call it that, is the fact that it isn't original. Y''know, what with being a sequel and all.

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Renegade_Turner » Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:56 pm

Are people really such petty dickheads that they'd downvote a game for something like that? I haven't even played the game and I can even say I'm certain it doesn't deserve 60/100. I've never been one of the people who went crazy about Portal, or that were breathlessly awaiting Portal 2, but that's just fucking stupid. What mindless pawns, they're just downvoting something to be stubborn out of some misguided sense of entitlement, I hope they all choke on their own vomit and die.
Renegade_Turner wrote:
Assaultman67 wrote:There's something key here in your post. I can't quite figure out what it is.
You're right, its more like millions (billions?) of products. (I said 100's because thats probably how many times I've thought personally have consciously thought "I want that, but not bad enough to pay ___ for it")
I think you missed the point of my post.

I meant to say that what you were arguing was ridiculous since it's the nature of things for there to be things you can't buy. It's like feeling entitled to a free copy of Microsoft Office 2010 because you bought a Windows PC in 2009.

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Re:

Post by Blorx » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:20 pm

Zhukov wrote:*sigh*

Blorx, have you even played it?
No, and I can say without a doubt that I probably won't unless someone gifts it to me.
Zhukov wrote:Because your facts are all over the place. For a start, the single player is just over three times the length of Portal 1. Then there's the co-op on top of that.
So wait, it is 9 hours? A ton of people are saying it's around 4-5 hours, which, short campaign length is the same reason I didn't buy Mirror's Edge when it was released at $60. Also, the co-op doesn't exactly do much to save a short campaign for a lot of people who will undoubtedly not ever touch it.
Zhukov wrote:Also, $50-$60? I got it off Steam for $45..
I think I recall earlier arguments expressing how little $5 is.

Even so, yes. $50-$60. Preorder was discounted $5 for either version. If you'll look here, you'll see it's now sneakily made it's way back up the mountain that is...$5. The $60 price point comes from the console versions.
Zhukov wrote:As for the DLC, I don't see the problem. It's just hats, coloured skins and funny gesture animations. Completely unneccesary stuff. Not having them doesn't detract from the game..
Well, right now, that's all it is. It's the Team Fortress 2 model being moved to another game. But the point isn't that it's completely unnecessary. The point is that they're charging you full price for this game and then asking a whole $2 to make your guy wave or something, and then a whole $5 to give him a silly hat. And they're doing this in a mostly single-player game. The fact that it exists is completely unnecessary. Why make a player pay to unlock such stuff when you could have just made them secrets in-game and created more content by simply hiding a few things. You know, like they used to do.
Zhukov wrote:The Metacritic thing is due to an amazon-bomb style swoop by the folks at /v/. A pack of entitled dipshits with a pathetic little axe to grind. Note that the critics, y'know, the people who actually do this for a living, are giving it an average of 96..
Well, you see, the critics really don't mean much. It's a matter of preference, and there are extraordinary games that have been given shit scores while there are horrible games that have been given great scores.

Now, the /v/ thing, I didn't know. Kotaku doesn't mention that and there aren't a whole lot of places that do coverage like that.
Zhukov wrote:In conclusion, the game is good. It has everything that made the original awesome and then some more. The only problem, if you can call it that, is the fact that it isn't original. Y''know, what with being a sequel and all.
Well, that's expected. But see, even so, there are things keeping me from buying this game.

1. The length. After being spoiled by JRPGs like Persona 3 FES (released at the awesome price of $30, comes with over 130 hours of gameplay and is an awesome game), Resonance of Fate ($60 at release, but over 150 hours of gameplay and an awesome game), and such, it's just really, really hard to justify buying a game that's a mere 10 hours or less for $60. The last game I bought like that was Heavy Rain. Even though I thought it was a great game, that was about the time I started to equate things a little more.

2. The "cash shop." I'm one of those people that was pretty heavy into Nintendo when I was younger. More than anything, these little things that are usually collectibles that are being put into DLC these days and, much less being put into them at ridiculous prices ($5 for a hat here, $50 for a hat there...hats that don't even exist, moreover) are just proving how much gaming is changing from trying to make a game that's memorable to trying to make a game that sells the most. Mind you, there are obvious exceptions to that, but there aren't a whole lot of them anymore.

3. It's a sequel, and that's all it's being recognized as. It's a "it takes the original game and adds a bit more to it, but that's about it" game. Sure, it's getting rave reviews, but so did a lot of sequels to games that were heavily praised, and they always seem to live in those games' shadows. I don't want to play Portal with a little extra stuff and a co-op campaign for good faith. The first game already blew my mind. Unless you do something to completely turn it upside-down, then the sequel's just going to be "another Portal game".

There's probably a bit more I could add, and this last part is all opinionated (obviously), but that's how I see it. After the failed means of advertising and then the "cash shop" from launch in a game that's mostly single-player, the idea of buying a game for $50-$60 just doesn't appeal.

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Renegade_Turner » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:25 pm

It's supposed to be more than "Portal with a bit more added in", as you put it. I guess we'll have to play it and, until then, our opinions are invalid.

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Blorx » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:30 pm

Renegade_Turner wrote:It's supposed to be more than "Portal with a bit more added in", as you put it. I guess we'll have to play it and, until then, our opinions are invalid.
Yep. Guess so.

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Freshbite » Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:46 pm

I really don't go to Metacritic to find an overall user score.
Usually, I go looking for that at Gamespot.

The user base at Gamespot tend to love games, and as such gives their honest opinion, whilst at Metacritic, people just love to criticize. The critics score is a different matter, however.

On another note, I think I've found the quote of the day just now.

"When I was talking about smelly garbage just now, it was only a metaphor. I was actually talking about you."

Ohh, Glados... You're so silly. Image

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Post by Zhukov » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:29 pm

Blorx wrote:[The point is that they're charging you full price for this game and then asking a whole $2 to make your guy wave or something, and then a whole $5 to give him a silly hat. And they're doing this in a mostly single-player game. The fact that it exists is completely unnecessary.
...

So don't buy the hats.

Hell, I'm not going to.

Is that really such a hard concept to get your head around?

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Post by Zhukov » Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:36 pm

Oh hey, look.

The user Metacritic score just doubled overnight.

So... Blorx, oh great believer in the Metacritic userbase, does that mean that the game has just spontaneously become better?

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Re: Portal 2

Post by Freshbite » Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:51 pm

Just played it through, about 7½ hours of straight gameplay in the Singleplayer Campaign.
You know what? I bloody liked it.

Now... about that sorting algorithm.
I guess it have to wait, I have to get some sleep... 5 hours will suit me nicely.

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